Same Story New Day

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Same Story New Day

Post  Chris on Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:17 am

I was warming up for the usual Thursday class last night when one of the regular lads walked through the door with a cracking black eye crowning off some other scuffs and scrapes.

After watching him for a while I noticed that he wasn't his usual self at all, sitting quietly and white as a sheet in the corner where normally he is very easy going, engaged and smiling. (the easy going and smilingis a pre-requisite of our training group... no taking yourself too seriously is allowed)

I asked him if he was okay and he shook his head.

It transpires that he had been involved in a fight at the weekend and had been knocked clean out. First time in his life. As a result his confidence is understandably shaken and he has been caught in a cycle of mentally running through the events of that night. He is looking for answers that will never be sufficient.

I asked him for details about the event, in the hope of picking out some facts I could use to help him make sense of what happened. This is a young, fit, strong and tough lad who has always been more than capable. To be beaten in this way has rocked his core. I was looking for information which would explain and make sense of the loss.

He told me that he had been out drinking with male family members. He was drinking faster and in more quantity than he would ever usually consume. He estimated that he had downed at least eight maybe nine pints.

He was drinking in an area he didn't know, an area which is known for being rough and ready. He admitted that the more he drank the more on edge he became.

There was a verbal argument with a group of young men who were in the same bar. Early twenties (he is 23 or 24) and this escalated into a heated, ego fuelled confrontation

The challenge was issued and accepted for a match fight with the leader of the group of three. By this time he told me he was enraged and revved up.

The two lads squared up and the opposition took his jacket off leaving a vest top underneath (classy!). My friend tells me that his wasn't a big guy but he was in good shape and ripped.

My friend tells me the other lad bounced around a little. My friend threw a big hook which missed and the next thing he remembers is being sat on his backside on the pavement. Classic KO.

He can't make sense of how he was KO'd so easily and the black dog is barking firecely at him.

First of all I ran him through the usual lecture about being that drunk, engaging in social violence etc. At the end of the day this isn't some areshole, he's a good lad with a young family and fighting in the street is completely out of his nature. If he hadn't been drunk he would never have been in the argument in the first place. I also warned him about who he was drinking with and asked why someone didn't at least put a warning voice in his ear. Ultimately though, I have made the same mistakes myself so I can't get too holier than thou about the drinking or the argument.

I then ran through the opposition indicators. One, nobody ever accepts a fight expecting to lose. The other lad was confident enough to step into a separate pavement arena, he prepared by taking off his jacket and he accepted the challenge without any hesitation. Probably not his first time in the arena and likely someone who in light of his physicality has trained a little bit. (MMA is HUGE in that part of the UK and every lad under 30 seems to train at a MMA gym regularly) He got pulled into fighting the oppositions fight without even realising it.

He threw a BIG hook. Drunk and perception impaired and got countered. I am ALWAYS on him about his hands being low. This led me to encourage him to take it as a hard training session rather than a loss. I pointed out that if he had been KO'd in training then he would have dustd himself off and took it as a learning experience. This is no different. He needs to look at it as a tough training session. No serious injury and no reason for him to look at it as anything other than some timely warnings. Take the benefit of the experience and move on leaving the negative behind.

I asked him why he let the opposition dictate the terms of the fight. I asked him why he didn't hit him while he was taking his jacket off. I asked him why he tried to hit him while he was bouncing around and I asked him what would have happened if he had engaged in social violence with someone who was meaner of spirit than his opposition in this instance.

He listened as he always does with intent and politeness but I could see that his confidence has been massively rocked. I like the lad a lot, he's genuine and knows he made a mistake but his self image is in pieces at the moment. I need to build him back up but I'm not sure that anyone external can help in that. It's an internal process for the individual
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  MikeG71 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:24 pm

I'm rather new and I hope you don't mind me jumping straight into such a strong topic.

I agree that this is an internal thing. I have worked with individuals who got rocked in similar ways to the chap you are writing about. I found that some would just hide for a few weeks until the pressure of the job crept up on them and they stopped coming to work, and that others turned into monsters in an attempt to over compensate for their mental situation.

For myself, I remember going back to work after I was bottled (after I was all stitched up and healed) and attending another kick off in the same bear garden with glass wear flying everywhere and as I was running in my brain literally replayed the entire bottling episode. I think it was a type of primitive, instinctual warning.

I coped with the second situation, and other glass wear based encounters after. Eventualy the negative images (of me being smashed in the head with a champers bottle) were over written with positive ones but it was always in the back of my mind as an eventuaity.

Sorry, no solutions or words of wisdom. Just shareing. Hope that's OK

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Mr Nobody on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:14 pm

Mike,

So basically jumping back into the fray worked for you? Albeit a bit more cautiously aware?
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  MikeG71 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:45 am

I suppoe I am, but I think it is worth considering that I would have had several smaller victories during prior work related confrontations before the bear garden kick off mentioned above and they may have helped ease me back in.

Sorry to be a bit vague. I've got lots of experience but very few opinions - lol

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Jagunco on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:56 am

Now that's somethign that every pub should have.. a Bear garden. I have visions now lol!
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  MikeG71 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:51 am

Hahahaha, that was me subtly trying to to make myself look harder. The venues I've worked in are so rough we had to have a garden for punters to keep their Grizzly's in!

Sorry, my spelling is a bit rubbish!

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Mr Nobody on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:08 am

I understand Mike.

I think realising your own mortality, your shortcomings, your strengths and haing a good control over your ego (in that everyone gets beaten at some stage) possibly helps in getting over bad experiences?
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  MikeG71 on Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:47 am

Yes mate I think Id go with that along with easing in with smaller victories.

Chris do you think any part of our ramblings will help the chap at your gym?

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Dave on Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:19 pm


1) I dont agree with agreed 'match fights' if you want to do these take up a combat sport and do it under rules such as MMA, boxing, thai, judo etc etc.

2) I am not a fan of anyone dealing with conflict when they are drunk, lesson here is dont get drunk in public arena.

3) I'm sure peer pressure of the male family members has played some part in this, be it 'egged' on by family or attempting to show off in front of them.

4) The lad is lucky he's got the opportunity to learn from this incident, as some people dont get a second chance.

5) Ego is the downfall of many young men especially when mixed with alcohol.

6) Its easy for me to sit here and point out my disappointment in this lads unwise choice of action over this incident, but violence is a serious business where hospital and prison can often be the result.

The bruises and ego will heal with time and we have all been there. I dont think it will ever change, maybe its all part of growing up. No


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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  KF on Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:39 pm

Agree with Dave's response but must admit to have done similar things in the past but luckily not suffered so badly.

Chris i think you did a great job by picking up on his state and following up on it. I thought reframing the event as a feedback opportunity was good.

I hope he looks back and puts it down to the valuable lesson it should be.

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Mr Nobody on Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:32 pm

Dave wrote:
1) I dont agree with agreed 'match fights' if you want to do these take up a combat sport and do it under rules such as MMA, boxing, thai, judo etc etc.

2) I am not a fan of anyone dealing with conflict when they are drunk, lesson here is dont get drunk in public arena.

3) I'm sure peer pressure of the male family members has played some part in this, be it 'egged' on by family or attempting to show off in front of them.

4) The lad is lucky he's got the opportunity to learn from this incident, as some people dont get a second chance.

5) Ego is the downfall of many young men especially when mixed with alcohol.

6) Its easy for me to sit here and point out my disappointment in this lads unwise choice of action over this incident, but violence is a serious business where hospital and prison can often be the result.

The bruises and ego will heal with time and we have all been there. I dont think it will ever change, maybe its all part of growing up. No



Good post Dave.
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Chris on Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:39 am

hey lads, thanks for taking the time to note your thoughts.

I agree wholheartedly with both Dave and Kev in that the lad needs to take a large slice of responsibility for what happened and also that he needs to understand that he was very lucky in the outcome. He is fortunate to be in a position to learn from his mistake without being any the worse for wear.

I also appreciate that I have made the same mistake myself and I know from personal experience how easy it is to let ego and anger influence the outcome of events. I can't be too holier than thou when I have acted the same way myself in years gone by.

He's back training, he seems none the worse for the experience and we dedicated the next training session to understanding pre-fight indicators and the ritual of violence. He had numerous clues as to the proficiency of his opponent but because of alcohol dulled senses he missed them all. I don't think he'll be doing that again anytime soon! Smile
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  nw on Fri May 10, 2013 3:30 am

I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him.
-- Mark Twain.

Says it all Chris!

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Chris on Fri May 10, 2013 3:55 am

nw wrote: I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him.
-- Mark Twain.

Says it all Chris!

words to live by! cheers
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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  David Turton on Fri May 10, 2013 5:38 am

until the principle vanishes and the guy assaults you

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Re: Same Story New Day

Post  Chris on Fri May 10, 2013 6:14 am

Well it's probably the ethos of every sociopath in the world as well so I wouldn't take it TOO seriously. Very Happy

As Bob Breen says, a fair fight is the last thing you want. Cool
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Re: Same Story New Day

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