? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

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? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  John Skillen on Wed Sep 13, 2006 2:12 am

If you study any of the above What do you consider to be your main artillery for the street? what is it that your art has that the others don't.
be respectfull on answering. Can you give the traditional name of the technique and the common name if you know them. Question
take care
John

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Ace R on Wed Sep 13, 2006 3:15 am

Hi John

Good question. I train karate and started in Shotokan. I have dabbled with many other arts as well. The works of Geoff Thompson changed my outlook and training with Harry Cook, Vince Morris and more recently Iain Abernethy made me see karate as I wanted it rather than the watered down tournament stuff that is so often ofered nowerdays.

Also I managed to train with Peter Consterdine at your place, which was an ambition realised.

Sorry to go off the track there a bit.

My main artillery for the street? Well for my pre-emptive strike I use the powerslap.
I train a range of punches and kicks, grappling, groundwork and throwing.

Some people question as to whether this is karate. I believe it is karate as it used to be, should be and maybe in some quarters, will be again!

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Jeff Menapace on Wed Sep 13, 2006 6:11 pm

Just ONE art? I guess I would pick boxing. Not only does boxing teach you to punch hard and fast with accuracy, but it also toughens you up and teaches you how to take a punch through proper sparring.

Jeff
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kyokushin

Post  Johan on Thu Sep 14, 2006 3:30 am

Hi,

I train in kyokushin karate. Never had to use my main artillery, but it would be a right cross (gyaku tsuki), hook or low kick (gedan mawashi).
If the fight continues, I would try kneeing the head (from a clinch), the crown jewels or the tighs.

These are the techniques we mostly train on and use in competition.

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  jimmyfatwing on Thu Sep 14, 2006 11:13 am

From old skool Savate (i.e. DDLR) you get some great low-line kicking techniques, coming under "coups de pied bas", "coup de pied chasse" and "coups de pied pointe". There's plenty of other goodies in there also for the hands, feet, head et al. Smile

I know I've bleated on before but the best resource if you're interested is the DDLR section of http://www.savateaustralia.com (and the rest of the site also if you've time).

I don't train in Savate / DDLR John but I do try to squeeze some stolen techniques in to my training Suspect
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Socrates on Fri Sep 15, 2006 2:51 am

What do you consider to be your main artillery for the street?

Good question, John. From wing chun, Iīd use the straight punch (yat ji kuen), especially with a swing of the hip or the body stepping behind it. It can be done with an empty palm too. Itīs a very powerful punch when done well. I havenīt used it myself, but someone I know knocked out a mugger with one punch after six months training.

what is it that your art has that the others don't. [quote]

Wing chun is a style that rewards lifelong training if you're careful with your shoulders. I know people who practice well into their 30s, 40s, 50s and even 60s. You're not meant to use body mechanics, sneaky tactics, and "structure" instead of brute strength in training, so it prepares you for the experience of defending yourself as an old git.

The other thing I like about it is the attitude that training is training and a fight is a fight. In other words, you develop certain attributes with a smile on your face in the training hall, but when it comes to a streetfight you just f@@@in' fight. what is it that your art has that the others don't. [quote]
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Steve.Bruce on Fri Sep 15, 2006 11:00 am

My background is mainly taekwondo and kickboxing and the main techniques I train for self protection are punches (jab, cross, hook), hammerfists, elbows and knees.

I also train slaps, finger jabs to the eyes and low leg roundhouse variations, but I probably use these a lot less when we do pressure drills. As far as being on the floor is concerned I'm going to bite, grab, rip, hit whatever I can to get up. I grapple a bit, but it is by far my worst range and wouldn't look to intentionally take a fight to the ground.

So no dollyo chagi (roundhouse kick) or bandae dollyo chagi (spin hook kick) to the head and nothing that I would say was particularly associated with taekwondo when it comes to self defence.

Perhaps more through luck than judgement I haven't been attacked by anyone who I have really had to fight. Over the years I've found that posturing has worked well for me in potential fights, but ultimately it's going to be a right hand that I'm going to throw it I need to hit someone.

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Lito on Sat Sep 16, 2006 10:39 pm

Hi John,
Just one system? For me, it's without a doubt, BOXING (modified for real-world "street" engagements).

Why? The hands are the undisputed "main artillery" natural body tools for unarmed combat and nothing surpasses boxing for the functional development of the hands in the physical sense.

Take Care,
Lito

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Ghost Of Avalon on Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:55 pm

It would have to be muay thai. That sport has so few moves that its simplicity is its strength save for the complete lack of ground work. My favorite moves are punches (straights and hooks/uppercuts), elbows and knees. However, I tend to throw my punches in a more MMA fashion so that the jab and the cross are almost, well, half hooks of kind. If you watch Fedor Emelianenko or Igor Vovchanchyn fight those are the kind of punches I mean. Heh, kind of like a mix of a straight, a hook, and an overhead. Kinda hard to explain.
I always think that the roundhouse kick to the thigh is too difficult for the street but in quite a few senshido-type, high-stress scenario drills I've ended up throwing one or two shins to the attacker's thighs. Once the guy started limping before the drill finished. On other occasions they've just limped after going to the locker room. In muay thai they don't really use hooks that much since they have elbows but I like hooks because of their longer reach and they somehow come very naturally to me.
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  John Skillen on Wed Nov 08, 2006 12:47 am

Boxing and Thia have a lot to offer in there simplicity you can strip both down to a single right hand punch.
nice one lads
John
chris have you read watch my back and red mist By Geoff great reads.

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Ghost Of Avalon on Wed Nov 08, 2006 4:36 am

John Skillen wrote:
chris have you read watch my back and red mist By Geoff great reads.

Actually I haven't. I'm currently reading Dead Or Alive, The Choice Is Yours. Hm, I'll just get those other two for myself as Christmas presents. Smile
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Rob Mac on Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:11 am

Out of boxing, a hook...I have a strange phobia about straight punches in 'live' situations. Open hand techniques such as bear-slaps also elbow out of Kung-fu. Straight pull-downs, out of judo; onto knee or expose back for elbow. Low-kicks/sweeps/knees out of Thai/kick boxing. This is pretty much all I use now and teach. These are, IMHO, the best tecs under pressure. I test them every week in sparring.
99 per cent of the time however I will open with a technique that isn't peculiar to any art, the headbutt. I love it, and have never lost with it..yet. pale
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  PaulRichard on Sat Nov 25, 2006 5:54 pm

Jeff Menapace wrote:Just ONE art? I guess I would pick boxing. Not only does boxing teach you to punch hard and fast with accuracy, but it also toughens you up and teaches you how to take a punch through proper sparring.

Jeff

Seconded and QFT

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Kemlyn on Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:12 am

JimmyFatwing mentions Defense Dans La Rue.
This is a fighting art from France in the late 1800s,early 1900s.
It was developed by taking elements of Boxing,Wrestling,Ju-jitsu,Savate and Weapon use(including walking stick,belt,coat,hat,knife,chairs and improvised or expedient weapons).
The background to this,was of cities overrun by gangs and criminal elements(sound familiar?),who themselves had practiced methods of deception and attack.
The tactics of the criminal gangs were absorbed into the mix of DDLR,
creating an effective,practical and more-or-less complete system.
For me personally,DDLR represents the ideal 'art'.
It is a real,no-nonsense fighting system,it is allied to combat sports which I love to play for health,fitness and pleasure,it provides a 'bridge' between sport and street/MMA and RBSD and it has historical and cultural aspects which thoroughly fascinate me.
I've started up a group to practice this wonderful art,based on the work of the past but still open to new ideas.
As J. F'wing has indicated,the best source for information on DDLR is Craig Gemeiner's 'savateaustralia' site,which Jimbo links to in his post.
Certainly,this is not the only system which covers most,or all,bases- but it definitely does it for me!
Peace.
Kemlyn.

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  brianlkennedy on Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:38 pm

I learned this from Andy Wang when he was here in Taiwan teaching. It has the blessing of simplicity.

Hands up
chin down
jab-cross, jab-cross
duck
take down (single or double leg as luck offers it to you).

Oddly enough the only, only time my father ever showed me any martial arts thing was when we were at Hickam AFB in Hawaii. I was in first grade and what did he show me? Hands up, chin down!

Now actually if I was teaching self defense what I would teach is a kind of Bauer "SPEAR" (i.e. arms up protecting your face, forming a "V" shape) and then drive into opponent and get double overhooks, pin your face right up against his and go from there. Obviously this is not a "one size fits all" solution. It works for me at 6 foot 230 lbs. It would not work so well for my wife (much smaller than I).

I realize the question was more about "what system" rather than "what technique" but nonetheless hopefully my answer is not way off topic.

take care,
Brian

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  John Skillen on Mon Apr 23, 2007 4:25 am

Hi Brian obviously meant you to hit first good advise thanks mate
John

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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Mr Nobody on Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:11 pm

I train in MT and Hapkido and did TKD previously as a teenager.

I think from MT right hands, hooks and elbows are my strongest hand techniques and knees and low to mid round kicks I can generate reasonable power out of them as well as being fairly quick with the execution. From TKD I have kept the spinning back kick and can work it pretty well when sparring but it is unlikely I'd use it in a fight. I'm not too bad with the good ol' front kick too.

From Hapkido I would use palm strikes/slaps and every other piece of dirty tricks the art teaches. There are some great takedown skills, locking techniques and chokes/strangles. I have also found that when grappling at MT the hip throws and foot sweeps learnt from Hapkido work brilliantly even against the more experienced fighters. However they are illegal for the ring but I'd rather know them than not.
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  Steve bungle on Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:03 am

I tend to rely heavily on punching so i'd say boxing,....i have a strong right hook.
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Re: ? 2 board members karate /kung fu/thia/box/savate/wrestling.

Post  cartmelpete on Sun Nov 18, 2007 11:00 pm

For me Boxing too. Lito put it pretty well perfectly.
All the stuff I've actually used for real is, as a pre emp a right cross or hook or something in between. Palm heels as well.
I've never really studied much else but have picked up things here and there from different people.
I like knees in close, don't know it they are "Thai" knees...just knees. I really like the head twist takedown which I've used for reall a few times. Straight fingers to the hollow beneath the adams apple to get out of a grab or being pinned against a wall. Headbutts, mostly in close but also as a pre empt. So I suppose these are from different arts but for me the main thing is Boxing.
Oh yes, thumb in eye too I've used for real. I suppose that's universal but it's also taught in Boxing as an illegal move......of course Smile
Jeff has it right when he says Boxing toughens you up too I think. Both physically and mentally. You get used to taking a shot to the head without going to pieces. I know Boxing isn't the be and end all but I see it as a great way to threngthen your mental resolve rather than just a pure physical excersise, though it's hard to find anyone who trains harder than Boxers.

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