? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

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? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Wed Sep 13, 2006 2:05 am

Who has had success with intentional judo throws in street scenario's There are many variations i know. Question
take care
John

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  blackbird on Wed Sep 13, 2006 11:03 am

Hi John, Ashi Guruma mate. This was my favourite as a kid in the dojo. It's gotten me out of trouble a couple of times on the street. I've been training to stay in striking range lately, but I reckon its always good to have something in the toolbox. With Ashi Guruma I usually get a good result but end up going to ground on top. Not where I want to be on the street.
What do you find most effective John? What would you recommend training?
Cheers,
Rob

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Thu Sep 14, 2006 10:57 am

osoto with a throat grab, neck / hip throw. Any of the trips and sweeps i've seen a few of the major throws used. Judo is really good for the street so long as you stay on your feet.
thanks mate
John

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  jimmyfatwing on Thu Sep 14, 2006 11:07 am

John Skillen wrote:osoto with a throat grab, neck / hip throw.

Not done one in anger but that was what came to my mind first...you can vary the pain level a lot with Osoto IMO.
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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  Jan on Thu Sep 14, 2006 11:08 am

Kawazu-gake, it's not ideal since you usually go down with them but you can use their body/head to break your fall.

It's not a devastating sweep but it gets you out of a bad clinch if you screw up.

My favourite is the minor inner reap, were you drag their foot towards you when they step forward. For absolute minimum effort you put them on their arse. The same simple sweep is taught in Muay thai.

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  blackbird on Fri Sep 15, 2006 5:01 am

Cheers, John. Not thought about blending throat grabs with simple sweeps. Suppose I've been stuck in the 'sport' mindset. Will definitely work this into the program. I suppose the throw is more effective as well because of the head control. Nice one.

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  Derek Gunning on Sat Sep 16, 2006 2:28 am

Hi John,

Only ever used two, Tai otoshi (sp?) from a rear choke (at work), and not so much a throw but an aikijutsu/aikido like technique I think they call it aiki nage or tenchi nage.

Derek

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  Jeff Menapace on Sat Sep 16, 2006 1:30 pm

One of my good buddies, who has never taken a judo lesson in his life, has had good success in real goes with Osoto Gari. He says it was kind of instinctive for him and I've seen him use it several times with good success.
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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Mon Sep 18, 2006 2:28 am

Now thats the word instinctive. When you pull a move off in the street, at the very next gym session you should drill that technique that worked for you and take it to another level. when i first used the osoto gari it actually came of a throat grab. you grab the throat to negotiate with your antagonist and to get rid you cast away or ram against a wall. with the throat grab you can guide the head to where you want it where the head goes the body must follow.
some good sound information here keep them coming.
John

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  Lito on Mon Sep 18, 2006 4:18 am

Hi John,
The only judo throw I've ever used in real situations, on a few occasions, is an osoto-gari. It worked as intended each time. Wink

Take Care,
Lito

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  CraigM on Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:11 am

Osoto gari is the king of throws. John you mention it with a throat grab round the larynx. Perfect!..Its a nasty painful finishing throw when done at speed and can even be used a s pre empt! Shocked

Osot with a chin jab also. Well kind of bastardised osoto since the assailanlt will more than likely be half out due to the impact of the chinjab anyway. The rest is just helping them down.

There are quite a few throws. Ouchi gari then land ontop of the assailant with your right forearm across his throat. He's not getting up from that (by the way not used that one. if i did i would be writing this from jail most likely)

Great thread.

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  CraigM on Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:13 am

As an aside to the subject of throws. John have you ever used a Kataha Jime in the street/on the door using someones jacket/t shirt? Its a lovely little choke. Most people love the Hadaka (rear naked) but kataha is a nasty little fooker!

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:50 am

Without wanting to sound too cocky, I have had the opportunity over the years to use most things practical in some variation or other. I use a nice kata ju-jimi style rising choke by gripping the cloth on the left lapel or shoulder with my right hand with the other hand underneath the forearm gripping the cloth around the coller/neck area then force the elbow forearm across the throat extremely effective for restraint or negotiation or depending on your strength knockout!
John


Last edited by on Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:59 am; edited 2 times in total

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:55 am

I have been caught in the two handed lapel grip though myself the guy applying it was a strong aggressive f88cker, I used a real cool highly skilled technique to get out of his grip - I talked my way out:lol: ! A few months later I brought the situation to a conclusion this time there were no words.Wink
John

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  mattyboy on Mon Sep 18, 2006 12:58 pm

Im not a Judo Man at all, but i did it as a kid most of the time in a fairly Happy Go Lucky/ Get Out the House type Way...I only everremebered a couple of things..but the one technique i have used time and time again is the most basic one..Tai O Toshi...ive used it for real about 5 times..again i probably dont even do it properly but its the one thing from Judo I got and feel comfortable using!!!!!


Matty
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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  Kemlyn on Fri Sep 22, 2006 4:22 am

O-soto gari.
Plus loads of times pushing,pulling,spinning,ragging(etc.)people to the floor(Kuzushi?Te-waza?).

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  edbaker on Tue Sep 26, 2006 8:16 am

just found this thread - judo was my first martial art and I loved it!! O soto gari works for me if someone starts to throw a right hand haymaker or push i burst forward inside the guard and aim to take my head past theirs hitting their chin/face hard with my right shoulder on the way through. This is not effective against a much heavier/stronger/shorter opponent though.

I have used inner and outer leg ankle sweep which I threw from pulling them around (to my shame can't remember the name)

I have used o goshi and bastard variations of it to great effect - before I understood more about getting up again!! For me it is a better take down in terms of impact if you land on the person than a shoot in wrestling.

In MMA I have used judo to my advantage a lot - wrestlers know little or nothing about sweeps and I can submit from geeza gatame not just mount or side control!!!

Judo is great!!!
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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:48 am

Nice one Ed, Judo has got to be the best alround art for tactile awareness regarding the street.Cool
Take care
John

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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  edbaker on Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:34 am

John, I got roasted last night at a shoot boxing session, we were grappling upright, trying to get double underhooks, and me and this chap ended up in a position where i basically had him in a headlock (playground style) and would have gone for tai o toshi (i think that is correct name, like o goshi with legs wider?!) and i would have got it but he would have ended up in the wall so i held off. Then the instructor bollocked me in front of the class saying "don't use that childish fucking headlock shit that's for pussies you've never been in a real fight have you what the fuck was that etc..." and then forced me to try it on the guy again so he could do a wrestling counter to it. Luckily he said (rather rudely i thought) "don't hurt him" and i was embarassed as i put on a headlock and then he countered it - but this was obviously not a "real" situation. Then later he said you can't submit from scarf hold (naturally where you would land off that throw or even off o goshi) and "only pussies" would tap out from scarf hold.

I felt very embarassed but i don't think this is true - you can make headlock throws work and i have submitted people from scarf hold, bigger, stronger people at that, not through technique perhaps so much as strength.

What is your experience of scarf hold submissions/head lock throws?
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Re: ? 2 board members: Judo throws for the street

Post  John Skillen on Tue Oct 03, 2006 10:08 am

Fighting is not a game, sport is!! The playground fighting technique is natural fighting and the headlock or face bar is a painful experience. Let out one big meow and continue to practise. The proof is in the eating of the pudding. fighting for real is totally different to sport or practise. When you train with an instructor you place yourself into his/ her care and guidance as The late great Bruce Lee once said "take from your training what is usfull to you and discard what is not".
Good instructors tell it like it is maybe you should ask your coach or the instructor why!! he thinks both techniques are invalid for sport or street. He may well have a good point worth listening too.
good luck
John

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